Gotnext Women's Basketball Boards

kingbt · Joined: 03 May 2003 Posts: 70

I am surprised that the Mercury haven't made a GM change. 5 years without making the playoffs must be the longest any team has gone in the WNBA. I know that GMs have gotten the boot for much less than that.

Hoopslady · Joined: 13 May 2004 Posts: 127 Location: Illinois

you must be a brave person

aml10 · Joined: 09 Jul 2004 Posts: 323 Location: iowa

if it's conflicting emi's interests, then it's definitely conflicting mine 8)

i choose dunkin' dan! wait.. what are we voting on?

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

Kingbt, name those GMs, cause the only one I can think of is Clarissa Davis who was not fired just had her job description changed this year, which was done here in Phoenix in 2003 when they hired Jay Perry.

kingbt · Joined: 03 May 2003 Posts: 70

"Kingbt, name those GMs, cause the only one I can think of is Clarissa Davis who was not fired just had her job description changed this year, which was done here in Phoenix in 2003 when they hired Jay Perry."

Are you contending that every team in the league has their original GM? If so, name each of those long time GMs. I think you would probably not get past Carol Blazekowski for New York and Van Chancellor for Houston, the league's two most successful franchises.

You won't have any luck with Washington, since Melissa McFerrin only lasted a year or two. She succeeded at least one GM and was succeeded by at least one GM. I think Wes Unseld was their original GM. Up at Sacramento they have a coach/GM. That coach/GM has not been with the organization since the beginning so obviously some GM or coach/GM got the boot. Brian Agler was coach/GM at Minnesota. Not any more. Linn Dunn was Seattle's coach and GM. Not any more. Penny Toler is LA's GM, but she used to play for LA so some GM at LA was replaced by Penny. Trudy Lacy is GM at Charlotte. She was not their original GM.

But let's not focus on the "got the boot for less part" - can you name any other WNBA team that has gone 5 years without making the playoffs?

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

Most of the people you named were not fired. Agler was fired. With McFerrin, there were other issues...namely her partner, who was just fired as the coach. Dunn resigned to take care of her sick mother. Minnesota does not have a true GM, having not officially replaced Agler.

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

Quote: can you name any other WNBA team that has gone 5 years without making the playoffs?

None. We have the streak.

In the meantime, we had the same record as Detroit the last two years. They made the playoffs both times; we did not.

kingbt · Joined: 03 May 2003 Posts: 70

"Most of the people you named were not fired. "

That doesn't seem correct. I mentioned Sacramento, LA, Charlotte, Minnesota, Washington and Seattle. If Lin Dunn really left voluntarily that still leaves 5 teams. Melissa McFerrin did not leave because of Nanch Darsh being fired. She stayed on and hired Tom Maher and after a bad season they both were shown the door.

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

Cheryl Miller was the Mercury GM, Seth did not assume the title till she left, so Blaze and Van are the 2 long standing GM's.
Van won't get fired as long as he's still coaching, and Blaze, well many in NY would argue she should be fired or publically burned at the stake :shock:

Whisnet in Sacramento became Coach but was already the assistant GM, so maybe instead of firing Sulka he should be made Coach :wink:

The problem is we are comparing apples and grapes because each team has their organizations structured different. Seth has only been solely in charge of basketball decisions for 2 years, that said, one more year of missed play offs and I'd say they have to re-evaluate his performance.

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

kingbt wrote: "Most of the people you named were not fired. "

That doesn't seem correct. I mentioned Sacramento, LA, Charlotte, Minnesota, Washington and Seattle. If Lin Dunn really left voluntarily that still leaves 5 teams. Melissa McFerrin did not leave because of Nanch Darsh being fired. She stayed on and hired Tom Maher and after a bad season they both were shown the door.

McFerrin resigned. She was not fired. In fact, she resigned several months after Maher was fired.

You also assume those teams had GMs who were fired. Not all of them did.

kingbt · Joined: 03 May 2003 Posts: 70

"McFerrin resigned. She was not fired. In fact, she resigned several months after Maher was fired. "

Wrong. They were shown the door together.

http://www.canoe.ca/Slam020104/wnba_mys-st.html

"Friday, January 4, 2002
Mystics GM Melissa McFerrin, coach Tom Maher resign
WASHINGTON (Ticker) -- Washington Mystics general manager Melissa McFerrin and coach Tom Maher both resigned Friday after their team tied for the worst record in the league last season. "

kingbt · Joined: 03 May 2003 Posts: 70

"Cheryl Miller was the Mercury GM, Seth did not assume the title till she left, so Blaze and Van are the 2 long standing GM's."

Well, weren't you challenging my statement that many GMs had been shown the door for less (than 5 years of missed playoffs)? Sounds like I was right.

"Whisnet in Sacramento became Coach but was already the assistant GM, so maybe instead of firing Sulka he should be made Coach"

Seth Sulka does have as much coaching experience as many of the coaches the WNBA hires. ;)

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

kingbt wrote: "McFerrin resigned. She was not fired. In fact, she resigned several months after Maher was fired. "

Wrong. They were shown the door together.

http://www.canoe.ca/Slam020104/wnba_mys-st.html

"Friday, January 4, 2002
Mystics GM Melissa McFerrin, coach Tom Maher resign
WASHINGTON (Ticker) -- Washington Mystics general manager Melissa McFerrin and coach Tom Maher both resigned Friday after their team tied for the worst record in the league last season. "

Gotcha. Got the dates wrong (Nikki McCray trade was what happened earlier).

Detroit has had the same record as Phoenix the past two years, with much more talent. Yet you aren't calling for Laimbeer's head.

Seth Sulka does not control what happens on the court. He didn't decide Sandora's minutes (or Angelina's minutes). He didn't run the offense. Fact is, the team was 33-35 over the past two years, which is not terrible. The team is on the cusp...just need a good coach to take us over the top.

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

FYI, the majority of board posters here were in favor of Graf's hiring, myself included. Seth made that call. He got Penny over LaToya and Chasity (remember, Penny wasn't even sure she would play in the WNBA in 2004, and Seth got her to so). It just didn't work out with Carrie. But Seth made the right call at the time.

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

More FYI...the responsibilities of player personnel and coaching hires have only been those of Seth Sulka for the past two years (as Caune noted).

1carol · Joined: 17 Jul 2003 Posts: 1043 Location: Phoenix AZ

Quote: http://www.thenewstribune.com/sports/story/5185279p-4713387c.html

Storm assistant coach opts to leave team

News Tribune staff
Published: September 17th, 2005 12:01 AM

Jenny Boucek, who had been a Seattle Storm assistant coach for the past three seasons, has decided not to renew her contract with the team, it was announced on Friday. Her contract expired this month, and she had been expected to resign.
Boucek was is in her sixth season as an assistant coach in the WNBA, having spent three seasons with the now-defunt Miami Sol.

Boucek is thought to be a possible candidate to replace Carrie Graf, a former Storm assistant coach who was let go as the Phoenix Mercury coach at the end of the WNBA regular season last month.

The Storm said that Boucek decided not to return to Seattle for personal reasons.

Any "rumors" closer to home?
I don't know anything about Boucek. Anyone want to comment?
We can ask Penny to ask LJ to check it out & tell us about her :lol:

SportsFan48 · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1134

1carol, I don't know much about Boucek but our best player source of information would be Kamila.

I have head Boucek's name mentioned as someone worthy of a look.

Hoopslady · Joined: 13 May 2004 Posts: 127 Location: Illinois

she played for Cleveland and then got hurt and so went to coaching. She did play some football in the WPFL while in Miami so she is tough.

I think that the Mercury have to get and hire someone ASAP, because to wait until the assistants are hired and the draft is over, well that is just backwards

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

The draft isn't till April, so I don't think we need to hire anyone this month :roll:

We should wait till the WNBA play offs are over in case we want to interview Whisnits assistant, the italian guy, Sonny Aba something.

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

Quote: think that the Mercury have to get and hire someone ASAP, because to wait until the assistants are hired and the draft is over, well that is just backwards

Retired WCBB coaches aren't going anywhere. But sooner rather than later is better, at least as far as getting acquainted with whatever players will remain in Phoenix. I would also prefer to know the situation with our assistant coaches sooner rather than later.

1carol · Joined: 17 Jul 2003 Posts: 1043 Location: Phoenix AZ

I'll be surprised if Timmsy comes back. A new coach will want to choose her/his own assistants. I don't think Timmsy is known enough as a coach for someone outside of AUS to choose her. We were fortunate she was here to teach Shereka when we were desperate for a point guard.

Hoopslady · Joined: 13 May 2004 Posts: 127 Location: Illinois

I didn't say the coach needed to be signed before the end of Sept, but remember that Graf was not named the head coach until after the draft and the asst coaches had pretty much been hired. I would think that the head coach should be signed before the end of the year so they have time to plan for the next season. Also the sooner the head coach is named the sooner that the GM can back to his off season work.

SuziQ · Joined: 17 Apr 2004 Posts: 288 Location: Phoenix

Gosh, it would break my heart if Timmsy went back to Oz! She's my favorite of all time, and just seeing her on the bench is good for me. But again, if we can get a top-notch coach, they should pick their assistants. You would think ridin' the pine for the Merc as an assistant (hasn't it been 2 or 3 years?) would get you some notice. But then again, looking at our outcome the past few years, maybe not.

I don't want anyone to think I'm a Graffie-basher, because I'm not. I was very happy when she was hired, and I think she has been our best coach to date. A real coach. But not quite THE coach. So close, and yet so far.

While watching Game 3 at Sac on Sunday, the announcers were talking about how in the W refs are nicer somehow - which caused Geno to say, "Wow, I need to get me a job in the pros!" To which there was likely a collective "YES, Geno, and here in Phoenix!" reply in the Valley a da Sun. Or maybe that was just me hearing myself plea out loud.

hellcat · Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:22 am Post subject:

SuziQ wrote: Gosh, it would break my heart if Timmsy went back to Oz!

She's already back in Melbourne. :P

SportsFan48 · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1134

hoopslady:

I agree that it seemed like it took forever to get Carrie on board, but she picked her assistants...so they were not hired before she was committed. I also, agree that it would be better if we had someone early. The main reason, IMO, is that it makes the fans more comfortable....and I am serious in saying that is important.

Right now fans are feeling let down and are wondering about the commitment of this organization. Getting a good coach on board would help to fuel the excitement for the next season.

All that said, I wouldn't want to act too quickly either.

Suzie....you heard me in the plea as well. :lol:

SuziQ · Joined: 17 Apr 2004 Posts: 288 Location: Phoenix

:cry: No wonder I felt a hole in the basketball world of Phoenix - no more Timmsy! And here I'd just found all those posters honoring Timmsy on her number retirement night. By the way, I have a few extras - if anyone in Australia would like one, I'd be happy to part with 'em. Oh, well, at least I got her signed bball at the auction, and got the poster framed. It'll have to do. What will she be up to in AUS, do you know?

SportsFan, a fan can dream, can't they!? But here's a question - is Geno a very good post coach? Seems like we hear more about UConn's guards and SFs than centers?

I agree, get a coach as quick as sanely possible, and of the best experience available. Fans will respond to someone who has a name for coaching, not a name for playing. We've been down that road twice now, and I, for one, feel that it would be the absolute WRONG move for the Merc now. Fans can only take so much.

One last thought - was John Shumate our Henry Bibby?

cbibat · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 232

Am not a fan of Geno being considered as a coach for the Merc. Don't think it would be the right fit. Do agree that, for the fans emotional health and well being, soon would be good.

kitkat310 · Joined: 20 Jun 2005 Posts: 303

Geno really hasn't had that talanted of centers..he seems to believe that the guards are more important (probably because he was a guard..)

But his center for the past four years was Jessica Moore..she's a good center..and before that..shuey..so..

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

kitkat310 wrote: Geno really hasn't had that talanted of centers..he seems to believe that the guards are more important (probably because he was a guard..)

But his center for the past four years was Jessica Moore..she's a good center..and before that..shuey..so..

Kara Wolters
Paige Sauer
Kelly Shumacher

All were ranked fairly highly by Blue Star.

hellcat · Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2005 4:39 pm Post subject:

SuziQ wrote: And here I'd just found all those posters honoring Timmsy on her number retirement night. By the way, I have a few extras - if anyone in Australia would like one, I'd be happy to part with 'em. Oh, well, at least I got her signed bball at the auction, and got the poster framed. It'll have to do. What will she be up to in AUS, do you know?

I'll put my hand up for DD and myself. :wink:

As usual Timmsy will be commentating for the WNBL on ABC. I'm sure there are other basketball related things she will be doing in Melbourne during the season. I think she was the MC at either the WNBL or Dandenong season launch last week.

SuziQ · Joined: 17 Apr 2004 Posts: 288 Location: Phoenix

Hellcat, I sent you an email.

While watching Sac win the trophy, the thought occurred to me - Geno's coached Swin Cash and Ajia (sp?) Jones, so not too bad, I guess.

I know Geno's not coming, CBIBAT, but at least he's experienced. That's the kind of coach I'm looking for - not another Shu or Coop. Carrie was close, and I hope she does well in the WNBL and gets to be AUS' Olympic coach.

SportsFan48 · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1134

suzie, I have a tendency to agree with cbibat: Geno's style really doesn't fit our team. I have waivered on the Geno issue wondering if our gals could adjust to Geno's style. I know DT wouldn't have a problem, but is it the style we want????? Or would the fans adjust???

As for being a "post" coach, I am not sold on the fact that we need our head coach to be a post coach....as long as we have a very good assistant who is and our head coach listens to and uses the assistants. IMO the head coach wouldn't be that good if he/she didn't listen to their assistants.

As for the Shumate question: My answer is NO. Shumate didn't have much of a team to work with. We had a bench full of the WNBA best come off the bench players, but no stars and solid starters. Anna was probably our best player and it really took most of the season for her to develop into the player she is today. Even though we had our worst win/loss season, the team played hard for Shumate. I believe his team really overachieved to some degree. There were only a couple of games all season that the Mercury were not in at the end. We had several games where the score difference was less than 8 points. That team was among my all time favorite teams to watch and cheer for.

Bibby had two of the best players in the game. And even though LA played hurt most of the season, many felt they underachieved with him. I think if he had stayed in all season, we would have been in the playoffs.

As for a coach....I am ready for a no nonsense, no name who knows the game, how to select good talent in coaching and on the floor, can deligate and not let his/her ego get in the way, is able to recognize the strengths in his/her players and uses those strengths, knows how to motivate, is fan friendly, and knows how to win the big ones once we get there.

1carol · Joined: 17 Jul 2003 Posts: 1043 Location: Phoenix AZ

Quote: As for a coach....I am ready for a no nonsense, no name who knows the game, how to select good talent in coaching and on the floor, can deligate and not let his/her ego get in the way, is able to recognize the strengths in his/her players and uses those strengths, knows how to motivate, is fan friendly, and knows how to win the big ones once we get there.

And walks on water. . . :wink:
:lol: :lol:

oddball8450 · Joined: 05 Jun 2004 Posts: 101

Quote: As for a coach....I am ready for a no nonsense, no name who knows the game, how to select good talent in coaching and on the floor, can deligate and not let his/her ego get in the way, is able to recognize the strengths in his/her players and uses those strengths, knows how to motivate, is fan friendly, and knows how to win the big ones once we get there.

And walks on water. . .

AMEN!!!! :D

Keegan · Joined: 13 Jun 2002 Posts: 977

1carol wrote: Quote: As for a coach....I am ready for a no nonsense, no name who knows the game, how to select good talent in coaching and on the floor, can deligate and not let his/her ego get in the way, is able to recognize the strengths in his/her players and uses those strengths, knows how to motivate, is fan friendly, and knows how to win the big ones once we get there.

And walks on water. . . :wink:
:lol: :lol:

Doesn't Diana already do that? ;)

hellcat · Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:00 am Post subject:

She only walks on water? I was lead to believe the earth rotated around her. My bad. :roll:

1carol · Joined: 17 Jul 2003 Posts: 1043 Location: Phoenix AZ

nah . . . she plays like the devil :twisted:
if you're on the other team :lol:

SuziQ · Joined: 17 Apr 2004 Posts: 288 Location: Phoenix

SportsFan, your analysis is right on - I asked the Shu vs. Bibby question more as an attempt to gain some insight as to why he was chosen and how well he really did. I think I have mentally blocked that year from my mind because we lost so much, so thanks for the refresher.

I agree, I wish LA had kept Bibby all year. The moment he left they got better.

And if we're looking for a coach w/ no ego, Geno is definately NOT it!

I just feel so strongly that we're on the cusp - we've got a great starting line, and a bench with tremendous upside, and will do some off-season work on our weaknesses. The right coach is the last piece of the Championship equation. I think it's the one thing we need to go from good to great.

librarygeek · Joined: 27 May 2005 Posts: 176 Location: Central Phx

Quote: She only walks on water? I was lead to believe the earth rotated around her. My bad.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Quote: As for a coach....I am ready for a no nonsense, no name who knows the game, how to select good talent in coaching and on the floor, can deligate and not let his/her ego get in the way, is able to recognize the strengths in his/her players and uses those strengths, knows how to motivate, is fan friendly, and knows how to win the big ones once we get there.
Amen, Sportsfan.

CamrnCrz1974 · Joined: 16 Jun 2003 Posts: 1689 Location: Central Phoenix

Quote: That doesn't seem correct. I mentioned Sacramento

Kingbt, Jerry Reynolds was not fired as GM of the Monarchs. He took a better paying job with the Sacramento Kings. Whiz was the assistant GM before he took over for Reynolds (but after Whiz had taken over coaching duties from Maura McHugh, who was fired).