Gotnext Women's Basketball Boards

minercon · Joined: 19 Jul 2002 Posts: 8

It appears to me that the majority of you that visit the Merc boards only appear to have one answer to the coaching problem....Graf.

I have a problem with Graf being the coach.

I feel she has good rapport with the players, which is a good thing. The problem I have with her is that she loads this team up with Aussie players. To be honest I don't think that the Aussies are half as good as the Americans or the Europeans. They, also, eventually quit on the teams that have acquired them because of pressure to stay home.

Colangelo pulled a major blunder when he hired Cooper. He should have had Donovan as the coach. She was a local product living in town on top of everything else.

At the moment Sulka should explore the possibility of having Charlie Turner Thorne take over the reigns. She appears to have a great personality, good rapport with players, the drive to make things happen, is a winner, and lives in town. He needs to do some research to see when her contract is up at ASU and if there is any hope that she would be interested. Too bad she can't keep her job at ASU and still be the Merc coach. The time period would be fine, but I am sure there are legal issues of being a college and a WNBA coach at the same time. I think Thorne could produce another winner here in town just like she has made the ASU girls basketball team a winner.

mb · Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2002 4:19 pm Post subject:

Donovan would have been fine by me.
Turner-Thorne would be okay also, yet I doubt that happens.

There are likey other names out there as well.
College fans, any ideas???

If Graf will come back, I'm all for it. The roster may have an Aussie or two, yet I doubt it ever is "overloaded" with Aussies again. In fact, I suspect all our foreign players will be scrutinized prior to next season.

Hang tough Seth! Next year has potenetial:

PG: Veal at 100% backed by Moises

SG: Grubin in her natural role, backed by Bonfiglio, and perhaps Fallon

SF: Harrison, backed by Reid and Saunders

PF: Christensen backed by Gillom and Tuvic

C: Stepanova backed by Williams and Tuvic

Two years out, a core of Veal, Grubin, Harrison, Christensen, and Stepanova with a more experienced Saunders off the bench sounds great to me!!!

Here's to the future: Kristen, Kayte, and Maria!!!

eaction83 · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 130 Location: Fremont, CA

I don't think a top drawer college coach from an elite conference, even a Bonvicini or Turner-Thorne, would ever consider leaving their job for the WNBA this offseason. There's just too much uncertainty about the future of the league and the labor unrest to be giving up the job security. But if I were Seth, the first three college coaches I would call would be:

Mark Trakh--Pepperdine
Janice Richard--San Jose State
Bud Childers--James Madison

Trakh is a strong teacher of the game (he was winning high school championships at Brea Olinda before coming to Pepperdine) and a very personable guy, that I got to know a little bit while I worked for the WCC. Since he's in a conference that is unfortunately much less-respected than it should be, and he's a single guy with no local ties, working at a small school with a tight budget, I think he would be receptive to overtures. He's had five straight 20-win seasons and taken them to the postseason 4 years in a row (2 NCAA, 2 WNIT), the only such postseason bids in program history, but anything more than a Sweet 16 run there is a real longshot.

Richard has turned San Jose State completely around in just three years after they were the joke of the west coast for the previous 20 years. She's a no-nonsense type who runs a disciplined team. She doesn't scream as much as Cooper or Miller, but she doesn't put up with slackers either--after her first year at San Jose State she basically "fired" all but a couple of her players and brought in a whole new group of kids who were actually willing to work hard and listen. And you can't argue with the results--they went from 3-24 her first year to 17-11 this past year, their best season since the 1970s. But again there's only so much she can do at San Jose State, which is always struggling to make ends meet even worse than Pepperdine is.

Childers I don't know as much about, since unlike the first two I've never seen him in action. But it's hard to argue with the results he's gotten at James Madison, which is always trapped under the huge shadow of conference rival Old Dominion. What I really like seeing though is that in games decided by 5 points or less over the past three seasons, James Madison is something like 13-5 (and that includes a 1 point win over ODU which is their only conference loss in the last 7 years), so he can obviously knows how to get his players to execute in crunch time.

Here are links to each of their most recent bios:

http://www.pepperdine.edu/athletics/wbasketball/trakh,%20mark.htm
http://www.sjsuspartans.com/article.asp?articleid=9697
http://www.jmu.edu/athletics/bball/bio-wbb.htm

Dunkin' Dan · Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2002 8:22 pm Post subject:

IF the Merc decide that Graf is the best choice for coach, then surely they can control who she 'loads up' the team with.
Isn't there like some kind of GM guy who has a little say in that sort of stuff?

I can understand the reservations about Aussies, since you were effectively burned by Fallon, and Brogan's situation might not have gone down too well either.
But surely that concern can be communicated to whoever the head coach is.

cbibat · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 232

Even if Graf were the answer isn't she untouchable now.... Seattle's not going to let her go

Dunkin' Dan · Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2002 10:34 pm Post subject:

Depends what kind of contract she is on I guess.
I'm sure the lure of a head coaching position would get her out of there.

Maybe Phoenix needs a completely new face though. Familiarity with the players has both good & bad aspects. Not saying I don't like Graffy, but let's keep an open mind.

M-Mart · Joined: 08 Jul 2002 Posts: 6 Location: Oklahoma

The Mercury could use a young, fiery, positive motivator...oh, and proven winner. One name that comes to mind is Sherry Coale from the University of Oklahoma. She may just be hungry enough to make the jump to the WNBA.

eaction83 · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 130 Location: Fremont, CA

See my post above. No way elite-program coaches like Coale are making the move this offseason, not with the labor unrest and disquieting rumblings about the league's overall health. The last thing they're going to do is leave a secure job for this league and risk having the league yanked out from under them.

Keegan · Joined: 13 Jun 2002 Posts: 977

Australians not half as good as the Europeans? Right... guess who's #2 in the world in women's basketball atm :roll:

As usual it's "bash the Aussies"... give me a break.

And I have a feeling that Graf is the heir to the throne in Seattle.

As for our new coach... well let me get back to you in the offseason.

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

I think there are 2 elite coaches that can be lured, and possibly one elite asst. coach
Leon Barmore is ready to leave college coaching, he's already tried once.....and I heard from a friend the C Vivian Stringer just might be ready for a change. Also Mikki DeMoss from Tennesse has been interviewing for some college head coach positions so it looks like maybe she is finally ready to cut the apron strings? That said, the Merc actually have a good record with their coaches as they have never fired one :wink:

We need a new coach next year and an an exorsicm to lay to rest those damn road demon :twisted:

eaction83 · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 130 Location: Fremont, CA

Barmore is a homebody. It's well known that he loves the Ruston area and absolutely hates long-distance travel when he can avoid it. He was one of the few people opposed to Tech joining the WAC for that very reason, and some have speculated that it was the prospect of all that extra traveling he'd have to do in the WAC vs. the Sun Belt that prompted him to retire in the first place. Since being in the WNBA means even more travel than that, especially if you're a west coast team, it's extremely unlikely he'd ever consider this job. Or any other WNBA job, for that matter.

Now the other two are intriguing possibilities, if...

Keegan · Joined: 13 Jun 2002 Posts: 977

Stringer's a good coach but I'm not sure whether the defensive grind style would be good for the pro game... (it's just so painful to watch).

DeMoss is definitely an intriguing prospect.

M-Mart · Joined: 08 Jul 2002 Posts: 6 Location: Oklahoma

It would definitely be interesting to see Barmore in the WNBA. His tirades directed at the officials followed by his fainting spells would be entertaining to say the least. The team would have to have a neurologist on staff just to take care of him.

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

Hey, coaches fly first class, so travel should be a breeze right :wink:

All I know is we need a coach next year who can help us overcome this roadblock we experience on road trips......and while we are at it, I call for new raod uniforms! No one can perform at their peak while dressed like a traffic cone! Those unis are the pits, and cursed too :twisted:

mb · Posted: Sat Jul 20, 2002 6:19 pm Post subject:

That's it!!! The reason for our road woes are the uniforms. Our level of play stoops to the low level of the uniforms. They are cursed.

The game (or lack thereof) last night has me so distraught, I can't even laugh at the thought of bringing bodysuits to the WNBA. Another reason to love Aussie basketball. :lol:

God please help us have a respectable game tomorrow. Actually, I expect a big win with plenty of bench minutes. Always the optimist.

The only bright sides to our road performance:

high draft pick
playing time for bench development
decreased letdown if the league has a stoppage

Luckily, I was dozing sporadically as I listened to the game. However, I do recall two long passes from Veal to Harrison for missed layups. On another Veal pass, Kayte was fouled. That would be three more assists for Kristen.

Tomorrow, I will be supporting our girls, yet my thoughts are of next season and the one after.

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

Unfortunetely we have to really suck, or be very lucky in the lottery, because at this point there are only 2 good college players ala Bird, Cash, Dales Shuman.

I do think we need to hire an intense coach, not Cooper intense, but someone who's strong and confident and able to really teach the game.
hmmmmmm
Seth, start sending candy and flowers to Micki DeMoss NOW!!!!!!
Wooo the heck out of her. Summit style is just what this team needs :wink: Heck take any assistant Pat or Geno have :!:

cbibat · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 232

we need to stick to a coach that has experience on the Pro court. there is such a difference between the pro game and the college game we need someone who is familiar with the schedule, the travails of a 3/4 mon season, no sustained practice etc. Someone who is assistant now or even a former defensive minded player.... teams seem to be having relatively good luck with former NBA players.

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

But who has pro experience that hasn't been a wash out? Greg Williams? Nancy Darsh? Linda Hill McDonald? or maybe an old washed up NBA coach like Cottom Fitzsimmons (please no :shock: ) or maybe Danny Ainge still wants to coach? I hear Kareem Abdul Jabber is available :wink:

Maybe one of the Houston assistants are what we need. Both have years of pro experience....

cbibat · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 232

Caune

you've mentioned John Shumate before. Surely within the league or the NBA there's another Michael Cooper-type. Heard fans in Orlando weren't happy about Dee Brown, but he's done well with the team. I think we need to look for someone who's played the game, as part of a team, not the star, has good people skills, is sound in the fundamentals of the game, knows what it takes for a team to win - an NBA vet who's 'toiled' through the system, played hard, retired but couldn't leave the game they love ( :lol: ).

Detroit looks better and has started to finish games under Lam.
Orlando is playing better than expected under Brown
LA finally reached the potential they were supposed to have the 1st yr of the league under Cooper.

and..wait, didn't Fitzsimmons 'rescue' the Suns a couple of times by coming back as a coach..... why not here... :P

Seriously though we've talked a lot on the boards this year and last about getting a coach who can coach. I just think we need to look outside the college ranks. I can't see college coaches, who have their players year round, for 3-4 yrs wanting to deal with a 3-4 month season and all its attendent problems.

Mat H · Joined: 24 Jun 2002 Posts: 168 Location: Glendale AZ

I have always said John Shumate was the individual for the job. If you listen to old Mercury tapes, he notices the little things it takes to win, he has a positve attitude, and the man knows his basketball. He knows the system and has the respect of the players. He would easily be my first candidate for coach! :lol:

Gaucho81 · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 147 Location: Ventura, CA

Here's a name drop: Brian Shaw of the LA Lakers

Brian is due to retire. He's been a great roll model for the team. He knows the game through and through. I read somewhere recently that Phil Jackson would consult with Brian on a regular basis.

Many UCSB fans are hoping that Brian comes back to UCSB as an assistant coach.

I think Brian has the potential to be a great coach. He Loves the game, knows the game, and is a great people person.

Hmm. Would he be interested in coaching the Mercury next season :wink:

What do you think?

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

:x Brian Shaw is a Laker, can we confine the search to ex NBA players who didn't play for the Suns most hated rival....no damn Rockets either, OK :wink:

But remember, for every Michael Cooper or Dee Brown, there is a Van Chancellor or Dan Hughes or Anne Donovan who came from college coaching.

I have always felt Shumate would be a top notch choice, as I am sure would a number of ex NBA players. But this next coaching choice is so fraught with politics, fan issues, long term vs short term....I would love to be a fly on the wall when this all gets sorted through :!: :!:

BYW Is this job, coaching the Mercury, considered a prestigiuos coaching job anymore?

bballprincess31 · Joined: 13 Jun 2002 Posts: 40

John Shumate is a good choice, I agree.

eaction83 · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 130 Location: Fremont, CA

What about Karen Langeland or Chris Weller, the recently retired coaches from Michigan State and Maryland? There's no doubting that both are very capable X & O coaches who know the game inside and out, and they were enormously popular with both their players and their schools. The reason they retired from the college ranks (Langeland especially) is that they weren't able to keep up with the demands of recruiting any more. That wouldn't be an issue in the pro game, leaving them free to do what they do best. In a similar vein, ex-Iowa coach Angie Lee might also be worth lobbing a phone call, because she was another one who could coach her butt off (84-60 and two Big Ten titles in five years at Iowa), but just couldn't bring in enough top recruits to keep the program at the level they were accustomed to enjoying under Stringer. Lee is an assistant at the U. of Denver right now, and I'm sure she'd love another crack at a head job.

And BTW, if you don't want to be coached by an ex-Laker, just think of Brian Shaw as an ex-Celtic, ex-Heat, or ex-Magic. He's played for all of them at one time or another. Actually, his best years as a pro were probably with Boston and Miami ten years ago. Or do the simplest thing and think of him as an ex-Gaucho, which is how I manage to stomach the knowledge that he plays for a team I hate. :wink:

caune · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1562 Location: Phoenix

He's an ex-celtic too? I forgot that part (blocked it out :wink: ) The celtics broke my heart regularly as a kid growing up in Milwaukee...if I could get my hands on the Havlicek, oh I'd.... :twisted:

Angie Lee is an interesting thought. A coach with her passion would be nice.

I think we are just proving there are still a lot of candidates..so maybe we should switch to listing our priorities, in order, of what we want in a coach :D
Then we present that list to management :wink:

Ohio Gaucho · Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 65 Location: Salem, OH

eaction83 wrote: And BTW, if you don't want to be coached by an ex-Laker, just think of Brian Shaw as an ex-Celtic, ex-Heat, or ex-Magic. He's played for all of them at one time or another.

Brian Shaw also has played 20 games for the Philadelphia 76ers, 39 for the Golden State Warriors, and 1 for the Portland Trailblazers, not to mention a year or two in Italy between Celtic seasons, when contract negotiations with the Celtics failed. He will become a great coach, with all the attributes required for success. No, he hasn't played for the Suns. :wink:

(BTW, I enjoy watching the Lakers. :lol: )

Go Mercury :!:
Bob
UCSB '61

eaction83 · Joined: 14 Jun 2002 Posts: 130 Location: Fremont, CA

And he hasn't played for the Rockets either. :D

LA was never a bad team to watch, unlike some that are downright painful. I just hate their guts. Even now that I'm not watching the NBA anymore, I still hate their guts. Which is only natural, since I grew up as a Warriors fan during the 1980's, when LA was winning everything in sight and we were mired in a decade-long playoff drought. Kind of like it is right now. :lol:

What do people think of an ex-Suns player following the path of Cooper/Brown/Laimbeer and becoming the coach, say like Majerle, Chambers or KJ? Admitting right up front that I know very little about their respective personalities and whether or not they're coach material...

gia · Guest

caune wrote: I think we are just proving there are still a lot of candidates..so maybe we should switch to listing our priorities, in order, of what we want in a coach :D

EXPERIENCE, Respect for/of peers and players, Ego smaller than a bread box

Anyone want to take a real stab at this? I haven't had enough coffee yet ;)

Mat H · Guest Joined: 24 Jun 2002 Posts: 168 Location: Glendale AZ

:idea: John Shumate John Shumate John Shumate.....problems fixed

SportsFan48 · Guest Joined: 12 Jun 2002 Posts: 1136

Brian Shaw just signed a one-year deal with the Lakers.

I really don't know who is out there and much about anyone. But I do know we need a good coach. Michael Cooper and Van are huge factors in their teams successes. The Comets have one of the best players in the league in Swoopes but the rest of the team is really pretty average. Thompson and Arcain might be a little above average, but not enough to justify their record. And think what they did last year without Swoopes and compare that to this season with Sacramento and Griffiths. The Lakers would NOT be three time champs without Phil Jackson. A good coach can make a big difference. I really hope this organization takes the time to look really hard at who is available and makes a researched and thoughtout decision about who our next coach should be.